Sunday, July 27, 2008

My Church is Bigger than Your Church

Try as I might, Bishop Bobby Duncan's claim that Rick Warren’s pseudo-Baptist flock at Saddleback are part of the Common Cause Partnership is one I just can’t stop admiring.

Brought to my attention a few days ago by a faithful reader who is much, much more than just another black sheep, at first it seemed that not even the Poacher of Pittsburgh and his friends could be audacious enough to claim the 22,000 people who allegedly gather at Lake Forest to experience Pentecostalism without the funny gurgling noises are really “part of the reunification of Orthodox Anglicanism”.

Yet sure enough, by going to the CCP parish finder and selecting “California” you end up here. (NB. Since this was first posted Saddleback has been removed form the list. Which just proves everyone respects Father Christian's teaching) Look halfway down the page at Lake Forest and sandwiched between St. Thomas Becket Church Lake Almanor and Christ Church Lemoore is the purpose-driven Saddleback Valley Community Church itself.

On this basis I’ve decided to up my own church’s prestige a little by claiming St. Peter's Basilica as our new European outreach, and consequently all who are in any way associated with the Church of Rome are now to be counted as part of the St. Onuphrias congregation. Which means we now have over 1.2 billion parishioners, and makes us the fastest growing congregation in history!

I’m Father Christian and I teach the Bible.


Leonard said...

I'm counting as fast as I can...still, it makes my head swim with all these new found zealots...ah, sweet mystery of life.

Robert said...

Which only goes to prove that size does indeed matter.

susan s. said...

Congratulations! A good bit of Fast Thinking!

Frank Remkiewicz aka “Tree” said...


Cany said...

Well, Fred, good question. Why?

I have been doing a LOT of reading on Warren and various organizations/individulals, but for starters, try this:

Fred Barns, editor of The Weekly Standard (TWS) is also on the Board of Directors of the IRD. He is also a member of TEC breakaway Falls Church, VA and has often advocated the position in articles in TWS etc. Barnes is also a political contributor to FOX news. He has a very long history in the conservative movement. He is a huge fan of Rick Warren.

Also on the IRD Board of directors is Roberta Green Ahmanson (Orange County, CA) whose notorious hubby funds many far right-wing causes.

The IRD has arms to many groups, including the Anglican Communion Network which, in 2005, had Warren speak at their conference (go here to read the article: ). Duncan was moderator of ACN and has a couple very interesting quote in that article:

"The logjam is about to break," says Pittsburgh Episcopal Bishop Bob Duncan, moderator of the ACN. "The way forward for biblical and missionary Anglicans -- and Christians -- is increasingly clear and involves all of us together."

A group of liberal church members said they were "perplexed" about some of the non-Episcopalians invited to speak, such as megachurch Baptist pastor the Rev. Rick Warren of Saddleback Church in Lake Forest, Calif., and Anne Graham Lotz, one of evangelist Billy Graham's three daughters.

"We believe that it is a positive development that attendees do not have to sign a theological statement to get into it," said Lionel Deimel, president of Progressive Episcopalians of Pittsburgh.

Warren's inclusion into the recent fray is listed, as ACN.

It would be foolish to believe that these folks don't have something else in common:


Warren shares those absolutist positions--he believes homosexuality is a sin and Jews will go to hell--but doesn't emphasize them. (For more on the culture wars, see the following story.)

Finally, this:


"Warren has called gays “unnatural” and part of a “hierarchy of evil.” During the last Presidential election, he urged his congregants to vote against a woman’s right to choose. He advises that gays and lesbians, as well as women who have had abortions should seek forgiveness."

Sound at all familiar?

Realize, also, that Warren has political legs and in 2005 began to look at Uganda as a place to work, evangelically, on the issue of poverty. Fair enough. But perhaps this quote, from him with his feet in THAT country, might shed additional light:


Popular American pastor Rick Warren said recently that he supports the decision made by Ugandan bishops to boycott the landmark Anglican conference to be held later this year in England.

Warren, who was in Uganda last week to launch the country’s first national Purpose Driven Living program, expressed his support last Thursday shortly after arriving in the country.

The influential pastor praised the Ugandan bishops who came across to him as "godly men who believe in the authority of Scripture, love Christ with all their hearts, and have a passion for taking the Good News to the entire world," according to an email sent to The Christian post confirming Warren’s support.

or maybe this:


Dr Warren said that homosexuality is not a natural way of life and thus not a human right. "We shall not tolerate this aspect at all," Dr Warren said.

Given many people's opinions that much of the Gafcon crowd espouses Baptist, Donatist and dominion theology, it should hardly come as a surprise, really, that he showed up on this list.

His qualifications are only second to those he is supporting, and since many believe we are fighting not Anglicans/Episcopalians but these Baptist, Donatist and dominion types cloaked in Anglican/Episcopalian purple, who knows. He is attractive as he is wealthy, powerful and can change his message, depending on audience, at a whim.

Padre Mickey said...

It appears that Mr. Warren's bunch have been removed from the list.

Anonymous said...

Clearly your Church Treasurer should move all Parish accounts to off-shore Banks.
Thousands of your new Curates are often involved in the most scandalous litigation.

Cany said...

I have been wondering if he landed there by error... surely a financial, philosophical supporter (?) of ACN and the splinter groups but not meant to end up so obviously part of this.

Nonetheless, it is important to know that his Purpose Driven Life includes dominionist views, and pronouncements of hate.

I guess if the good Rev. wants to work in Uganda, he needs those qualifications.